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Help me I'm turning to the dark side

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toaddog

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Tickle me!

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Post Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:24 pm

Help me I'm turning to the dark side

Of traffic enforcement

Two tickets yesterday.

101 in a 60 zone and the bloke driving next to me texting.

I was driving an unmarked 200 series landcruiser yesterday so that may have something to do with it.
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BundyRumandCoke

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Location: Central Queensland

Post Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:54 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

TD, with your knowledge of the rules here in Qld. The proliferation of LED light bars poses some interesting questions. The most common place is on top of a bull bar, or up on a roof rack.

I have both, almost. I do have a light bar up on the roof rack, but I have the fuse removed from the holder (under the bonnet) when the vehicle is used on the road. I only use it when off road. Is this legal? My thoughts are, it wouldnt be illegal to have it up there, just illegal to use on road, hence the removed fuse. Personally, like HID upgrades in standard headlights, I hate people who have operational light bars up top on the highway, that's the first thing that hits you when coming up over a crest. But I have been told by a reliable 4wd mechanic that if its up there, it has to be operational, but if its operational, then its illegal.

Second, my lightbar on my bullbar. Its not up on top, its mounted at 45 degrees on the top front quarter of the top bar. Its less than 1200mm from the ground, and its not the forward most projection on the bar. My understanding is that this allows it to squeeze in, as the 1200mm height, and forward projection, are the 2 criteria that are needed to be met for legality. The same 4wd mechanic, the owner of a 4wd workshop in Rockhampton, told me the bar is legal where its mounted.

Having asked this, I have not been hassled by the local boys in blue. They seem a lot more tolerant out in the country, applying a bit more commonsense than the hard and fast rule following of their city counterparts, realising that people are trying to see wildlife at night. But I am moving back to Gladstone in the next month or so, and so there might be a bit less tolerance there.

Image

Image
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RN

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A speed camera would have prevented that!

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Post Mon Jan 12, 2015 1:25 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

toaddog wrote:Of traffic enforcement

Two tickets yesterday.

101 in a 60 zone and the bloke driving next to me texting.

I was driving an unmarked 200 series landcruiser yesterday so that may have something to do with it.



...and I charged someone with an indictable offence the other month. :shock:
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chris_stoffa

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Post Mon Jan 12, 2015 1:33 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

RN wrote:
toaddog wrote:Of traffic enforcement

Two tickets yesterday.

101 in a 60 zone and the bloke driving next to me texting.

I was driving an unmarked 200 series landcruiser yesterday so that may have something to do with it.



...and I charged someone with an indictable offence the other month


I can see a demarcation dispute coming up here :lol:
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bru21

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Location: Sunshine Coast

Post Mon Jan 12, 2015 4:14 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

BundyRumandCoke wrote:TD, with your knowledge of the rules here in Qld. The proliferation of LED light bars poses some interesting questions. The most common place is on top of a bull bar, or up on a roof rack.

I have both, almost. I do have a light bar up on the roof rack, but I have the fuse removed from the holder (under the bonnet) when the vehicle is used on the road. I only use it when off road. Is this legal? My thoughts are, it wouldnt be illegal to have it up there, just illegal to use on road, hence the removed fuse. Personally, like HID upgrades in standard headlights, I hate people who have operational light bars up top on the highway, that's the first thing that hits you when coming up over a crest. But I have been told by a reliable 4wd mechanic that if its up there, it has to be operational, but if its operational, then its illegal.

Second, my lightbar on my bullbar. Its not up on top, its mounted at 45 degrees on the top front quarter of the top bar. Its less than 1200mm from the ground, and its not the forward most projection on the bar. My understanding is that this allows it to squeeze in, as the 1200mm height, and forward projection, are the 2 criteria that are needed to be met for legality. The same 4wd mechanic, the owner of a 4wd workshop in Rockhampton, told me the bar is legal where its mounted.

Having asked this, I have not been hassled by the local boys in blue. They seem a lot more tolerant out in the country, applying a bit more commonsense than the hard and fast rule following of their city counterparts, realising that people are trying to see wildlife at night. But I am moving back to Gladstone in the next month or so, and so there might be a bit less tolerance there.

Image

Image


They have just updated the light bar rules. http://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/safety/vehicl ... tions.aspx
Not sure on the details, as we usually fit spots.
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BundyRumandCoke

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Location: Central Queensland

Post Mon Jan 12, 2015 7:42 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

Yep, well aware of the May 2013 revision of the standards regarding fitment of LED light bars, and if you simply go by that, then I am all OK, but of course, its all up to the interpretation of the particular officer on the day. I was simply asking TDs opinion.
Mud makes excellent toothpaste.
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toaddog

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Post Tue Jan 13, 2015 10:10 am

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

Bundy - don't really have an opinion on it. I am concerned about the number of spots you have in front of your grill and the effect on airflow to your radiator.

If you haven't worked it out already I am not a big traffic nazi (not that there is anything wrong with that Bruce) and pull over people for doing stupid or dangerous things or hogging the right hand lane.
2008 Patrol wagon and 99 Patrol TD Ute
Cairns
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BundyRumandCoke

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Location: Central Queensland

Post Tue Jan 13, 2015 11:27 am

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

Airflow isn't a drama. Sits on about 1/3 normally. Goes up to around 1/2 when towing hard. Didn't have a drama on our trip last year, fully loaded up, and doing the Simpson Desert area. Cant remember the last time it went up over 1/2. The only noticeable effect on airflow is actually over the bonnet, my windscreen washers go everywhere, so there is possibly an effect on the intercooler airflow.

So, you don't contribute to Campbells Xmas fund hey, good on ya.
Mud makes excellent toothpaste.
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toaddog

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Post Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:13 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

As you get older your water tends to dribble everywhere....

As for arrests over christmas etc

1) Motorbike rider - no licence and .20 he was flat out staying upright.

2) 4 pounds of dope and 9000 bucks.

3) Shotgun, taser and 40gms of dope out of a car and a blood test done for drug driving

4) yesterday - bloke trying to beat up a male and female ambo yesterday - It always pays not to hide you stash in your wallet if you are going to play up like some arsehole mongel dog.
2008 Patrol wagon and 99 Patrol TD Ute
Cairns
<<

stockhorse

Posts: 245

Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 10:56 pm

Location: Brisbane

Post Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:56 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

BundyRumandCoke wrote:TD, with your knowledge of the rules here in Qld. The proliferation of LED light bars poses some interesting questions. The most common place is on top of a bull bar, or up on a roof rack.

I have both, almost. I do have a light bar up on the roof rack, but I have the fuse removed from the holder (under the bonnet) when the vehicle is used on the road. I only use it when off road. Is this legal? My thoughts are, it wouldnt be illegal to have it up there, just illegal to use on road, hence the removed fuse. Personally, like HID upgrades in standard headlights, I hate people who have operational light bars up top on the highway, that's the first thing that hits you when coming up over a crest. But I have been told by a reliable 4wd mechanic that if its up there, it has to be operational, but if its operational, then its illegal. Totally incorrect, you can transport a lightbar or spotties as you wish and they do not have to be operational as they are auxillary lights. Secondly lightbars/spotties fitted to roof racks are legal as per ADR's and Qld regs.

Second, my lightbar on my bullbar. Its not up on top, its mounted at 45 degrees on the top front quarter of the top bar. Its less than 1200mm from the ground, and its not the forward most projection on the bar. My understanding is that this allows it to squeeze in, as the 1200mm height, and forward projection, are the 2 criteria that are needed to be met for legality. The same 4wd mechanic, the owner of a 4wd workshop in Rockhampton, told me the bar is legal where its mounted.

Having asked this, I have not been hassled by the local boys in blue. They seem a lot more tolerant out in the country, applying a bit more commonsense than the hard and fast rule following of their city counterparts, realising that people are trying to see wildlife at night. But I am moving back to Gladstone in the next month or so, and so there might be a bit less tolerance there.
The problem you may run into is the number of auxillary lights you have fitted. You are only allowed up to four and they no longer have to be fitted in pairs but must be fitted symetricaly where possible.
Image

Image
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BundyRumandCoke

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Location: Central Queensland

Post Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:33 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

Early on last year, I was having a chat to a sergeant for a neighbouring town, which is where I was told about the change on May 3 2013, to the standards allowing LED light bars on the road. The changes allowed an uneven number of additional lights on the vehicle (which is how LED light bars now get by) and he also said the maximum number of lights on the front was 6, its now not specified. Its just a shame that that particular part of the standards is a bit harder to find. The LED bar standard was easy to find.
Mud makes excellent toothpaste.
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stockhorse

Posts: 245

Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 10:56 pm

Location: Brisbane

Post Tue Jan 13, 2015 9:48 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

Assessment criteria
Queensland Transport requires the registered owner of a vehicle to ensure the vehicle
complies with Queensland legislative requirements before the vehicle is
parked or operated on the road network.
As such and to comply with the requirements of the Regulation and the
ADRs, the following are the minimum requirements acceptable to QT for
the installation of fog or driving lights to a motor vehicle.
General
• The vehicle must continue to comply with the ADRs with the
system installed.
Page 3 of 4
Specific (Fog Lamps)
• A pair of fog lamps, showing a beam of white or yellow light, may
be fitted to the front of a motor vehicle with the centres no higher
than the top of the dipped beam headlamp and not less than 250
mm above the ground.
• The lamps must be mounted symmetrically (same position on
both sides of the vehicle) and not less than 600mm apart.
• Fog lamps must be capable of being switched on and off
independently of any headlamps but must only be able to be
switched on when the parking lamps are on.
• Fog lamps must not be used except in fog or mist or under other
atmospheric conditions which restrict visibility.
Specific (Driving lamps)
• Two additional pairs of driving lamps may be fitted to a motor
vehicle.
• The driving lamps must be mounted symmetrically on the vehicle.
• The light emitted must not cause the driver discomfort either
directly or indirectly through the rear view mirror and/or other
reflecting surfaces of the motor vehicle.
• Driving lamps must not be placed wider than the dipped beam
headlamps.

• The colour of light emitted from driving lamps must be white.
• Additional driving lamps must only operate in conjunction with the
high beam circuit and must be fitted with an independent on/off
switch.
• There is no individual height specification for the fitting of driving
lamps.
General comment
Section 219 of the Transport Operations (Road Use Management – Road
Rules) Regulation 1999 requires lights not to be used to dazzle other
road users and states:
"A driver must not use, or allow to be used, any light fitted to or in the
driver’s vehicle to dazzle, or in a way that is likely to dazzle, another road
user".
Additionally, Section 57 (Schedule 1, Part 7, Division 1) of the Transport
Operations (Road Use Management – Vehicle Standards and Safety)


Australian Design Rule (ADR) 13/00 requires that either two or four lamps are fitted.
Transport and Main Roads is of the opinion that this ADR requirement was set before the introduction of LED
type lamps and the requirement does not reflect this new technology.
To ensure national consistency, Transport and Main Roads raised this issue with the Australian Motor Vehicle
Certification Board, who have endorsed a change to the ADR to allow an odd number of driving lamps to be
fitted to vehicles. Until this update to the ADR is made, Transport and Main Roads has provided this Vehicle
Standards Instruction for ADR vehicles and vehicles manufactured prior to 1991.
Requirements for the fitting fitment and use of driving lamps including Light Emitting Diode (LED)
Light Bars on Vehicles, excluding motor bikes and motor trikes.
• The lamps should, as far as is possible, be installed symmetrically in pairs to the front of the vehicle.
• If lamps are not fitted as pairs (e.g. one, three etc), they must be fitted to the front of the vehicle,
symmetrically about the centre.
• The lamp/s must be installed in a way that the light produced does not cause the driver of the vehicle
discomfort either directly or by reflection.
• The lamp/s must only come on when the main-beam (high beam) headlamps are used, and must
automatically turn off when the main-beam headlamps are turned off.
Note: This exemption from complying with a part of ADR13/00 only applies in Queensland and may not be
recognised in other states or territories. Vehicle operators who travel between states and territories must
ensure that lamps fitted to their vehicles comply with the requirements in each state or territory.
(ADR 13/00 states a maximum of 4 auxilliary lights may be fitted, this section is not exempted under this ruling)
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BundyRumandCoke

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Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 10:55 am

Location: Central Queensland

Post Wed Jan 14, 2015 11:45 am

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

That's the 2006 standard/legislation, which has been superceded, in part, by the May 2013 document allowing LED light bars (a single light) to be fitted. That's why its now legal to have an odd number of lights fitted. They still have to be fitted symmetrically of the centre line of the vehicle.
Mud makes excellent toothpaste.
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stockhorse

Posts: 245

Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 10:56 pm

Location: Brisbane

Post Wed Jan 14, 2015 12:24 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

The point made in both of those documents is the vehicle must still comply with ADR 13/00 the current edition of which still states a maximum of four driving lights
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80's_delirious

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Post Wed Jan 14, 2015 7:57 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

Bundy, the biggest problem you have is your fear of the dark! You should see someone about that.



Interesting you chose a thread about "the darkside" to ask about lights :lol: :lol:
RN wrote:pussy is out, its the log for me... Thank you Jesus.
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BundyRumandCoke

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Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 10:55 am

Location: Central Queensland

Post Wed Jan 14, 2015 8:52 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

80's_delirious wrote:Bundy, the biggest problem you have is your fear of the dark! You should see someone about that.



Interesting you chose a thread about "the darkside" to ask about lights :lol: :lol:



Err, yes, considering this happened only a month or 2 after I paid out around $2500 for damage done by a roo.

Scroll down on this page to see the video.

Image
Mud makes excellent toothpaste.
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80's_delirious

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Location: Licking a window near you

Post Wed Jan 14, 2015 9:38 pm

Re: Help me I'm turning to the dark side

Err, so I scrolled down that page, found no video, just this.

Image

I'd hit that with or without a light bar :D
RN wrote:pussy is out, its the log for me... Thank you Jesus.

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